Lead On with Greg & Mark (LOwGaM)
We invite you to join us as we talk about the world of leadership during times of complexity.
Lead On with Greg & Mark (LOwGaM)
S5:E4 Are These Really the 5 Most Important Laws?
We're always interested in what others define as must-read leadership tips and tricks.
In this episode, we take a look at one group's take on the 5 most important laws in the world through our lens of life and leadership.
Some of them work; however, some don't resonate with us.
Let us know what you think in the comments... are we missing something?
Which laws would you keep on your own personal top 5? Which are missing?
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You're listening to Lead On with Greg and Mark, brought to you by the Pennsylvania Association of Intermediate Units. Join us this season as we engage in conversations on leading on through times of complexity. Now for your hosts, it's back.
Speaker 2:You can't help yourself. Staying alive, staying alive, love it, love it, love it. It's a lost art, can't?
Speaker 3:help yourself Staying alive. Staying alive, love it, love it. It's a lost art, maybe for a reason. Actually, those people telling you for me not to do it is motivating me.
Speaker 2:Oh, people love the beatboxing, then Let me try it the other way.
Speaker 3:People love it when you beatbox over the intro. It's a little passive aggressive on my part. That's okay, we'll let it slide. It's led, I'll tell you. Listen, we were just mark and I just went for uh lunch and I was so happy to see something, so we, our meals come out and honestly, they really really good, awesome lunch can't, can't say enough about it, but I've noticed that mark took a picture, oh yeah, of his meal and it made me feel so much better about myself because I catch myself doing that and I was like oh geez, how old am I that I'm taking and and not?
Speaker 3:no, no offense, but I took it. I'm like I I thought only old people take pictures of their. It was like affirming for you yeah, it's so. I realized yeah, does it make other cool people take pictures oh, there you go.
Speaker 2:Well, thank you. I took the picture so that I could send it to my dad, and sometimes, when there's a meal that, like I associate things with, people smells, songs, food, whatever tastes, and so I got a hot roast beef sandwich with French fries and, for whatever reason, I'm like my dad loves this. I'm going to send a picture of this meal to my dad. So what does he tell you? And he writes back and he goes it looks delicious, where are you at? I would have put gravy on the fries.
Speaker 3:Gravy on the fries, and for those listeners out there who aren't aware of the Northeastern traditions, it's called disco fries when you have gravy with fries.
Speaker 2:So we grew up eating that right? Yeah, I used to do it with my wife, so if I'm out to eat without her, oftentimes I'll take a picture of the food, because I'll order something that I know she would like. Yeah, a little little, and so if I know that she'd like it, I like to send her a picture just to sort of say look what I've got, you know, just a little nudge, a little look, a little love nudge.
Speaker 2:And then the funniest part is now I see our kids doing it like they picked up.
Speaker 3:They did it too. They picked up just old people.
Speaker 2:well, no, they do it because they see mom and dad nudging each other right, like, oh, you know what I mean. So if I'm away and they go and get ice cream or something like that, they'll send a picture of the ice cream. I'm like, oh gosh, that's great, it's like a wish you were here, kind of thing. Yeah, I's nice through food, would you like?
Speaker 3:me to start sending you pictures of my meals. I don't know. Let's see how this develops. Might be a little early, so wait a second.
Speaker 2:So that explains why I'm taking pictures of food so that I can send them to people. Why are you taking pictures of food? I just keep them in my library, Do you really? So you look at them Like I will never look at that picture again.
Speaker 3:So I took my last picture. I was away and it was a nice salmon on a cedar plank.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 3:And I just thought the presentation was really nice. So what are you going to do with that picture? I don't know, it's just there. I'll probably delete it eventually.
Speaker 2:I love that, so you didn't send it to Maria or whatever, I just kind of looked at it and it just looked nice, it looked nice, so you appreciate the aesthetic beauty of your food.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I didn't send it to Maria because she'd be like man, you're eating salmon and I'm eating like cereal or something.
Speaker 2:And that's rub it in just to rub it in right or to say hey look, you know, you're not here, but I got what I thought you would like.
Speaker 3:Yes, right, oh, exactly, wow I love it, hey.
Speaker 2:So, um, folks love it when we go down a list of things it's like sort of like a cheat sheet in the leadership world. We're good with lists, we're good with lists. So here's a uh hashtag, list, hashtag. Low, low gam lists, low gam lists with greg and markless. Uh, you changed the logo of the podcast, by the way, too. I like it. Yeah, you like it. It's sort of like the black and white sketch. Yes, like our faces it is.
Speaker 3:Nicely done. Yeah, thank you. Thank you, we were going with less is more.
Speaker 2:Less is more. With Lidon, with Greg and Mark.
Speaker 3:There we go, low gam.
Speaker 2:Low gam the world, so you want to talk about them yep, so let's uh.
Speaker 3:Do you want me to read through them first?
Speaker 2:yeah, where'd you find like, let's give attribution first of all? Uh, this is like a social media.
Speaker 3:This was a social media thing. It was posted by a company called glitch minds, and they also go by gm, um, not to be confused with the car company. So, but glitch mind. So the first is murphy law, or murphy's law. The more you fear something happening, the more likely it is to occur.
Speaker 2:That's murphy's laws defined, huh, the more you fear something happening the more likely it is to occur that's Murphy's Laws defined, huh the more you fear something happening.
Speaker 1:It's interesting.
Speaker 2:I always thought of Murphy's Law slightly different than that Murphy's Law I always thought was like if it can go wrong, it will go wrong. I always thought that was Murphy's Law. Right yeah, like what will go wrong or what can go wrong will go wrong.
Speaker 3:And they're saying here that you have that fear of something going wrong.
Speaker 2:So it in fact will the more you fear something happening, the more like I wonder if that's the law of attraction in reverse.
Speaker 1:You ever hear about the law of attraction where you put like you, you manifest what you want to happen.
Speaker 3:I'm not going to get into that, Mark.
Speaker 2:I'm with opposite of that. So like the more you fear like losing your job, the more likely it is you're going to lose your job because you're going to be doing things that cause you to not do your job and then you'll get fired because you've been worrying about losing your job, which has prevented you from actually doing your job. That's it and I don't.
Speaker 3:It's like a self-fulfilling prophecy it is. It is just like that parenting, unfortunately. Sometimes we, you know, as parents, we think about the worst things that can happen, but I, I know in many cases that's just a protectionist, like we're protecting ourselves from, you know, thinking, strategizing through it in this parenting, adulting world that we live in I wonder how you compare the more murphy law, the more you feel it's where there's no apostrophe either.
Speaker 2:Murphy law, murphy's law the more you fear something happening, the more likely it is to occur. You could compare that to being prepared. Yes, so like being afraid that something might happen would cause someone to prepare for its inevitable possibility and therefore be able to respond to it. That would be the opposite of this right Like, if I'm afraid that something's going to happen, I'm going to prepare for it and perhaps be have a response ready which, as opposed, to ignoring the possibility of something happening and then, when it does, I'm not prepared Exactly.
Speaker 3:Exactly so I don't know. I don't know. This one it's interesting. It's interesting that that definition but what's the but?
Speaker 2:all right, so it's a podcast about leadership. How does that resonate with you, with leadership.
Speaker 3:So my feeling with that one. They say the more likely. So the more you fear something happening, the more likely it is to occur. I think what we do in our positions is, the more likely we fear something's going to happen. We set up safeguards.
Speaker 2:That's what I was getting at.
Speaker 3:So that is what you're getting at. But that's not what this says, though this is not what it says, it's fascinating.
Speaker 2:I wonder what they're getting at. Let's get Glitch matrix on whatever their name is. Glitch, yeah, but I minds yeah. I would be interested in pokes in the comments like what? What is the leadership lesson here? The more you fear something happening, the more likely it is to occur. I love the idea of safeguards right, and I love the idea of like we were talking about like the opposite, like preventative yeah, being proactive yeah, all right, I don't know, that's that's.
Speaker 3:That's one we might need to circle back on. I'd love comments from our listeners on this one. You want to do number two, this one's more straightforward Kidlin Law, and it's if you write a problem down clearly and specifically, you have solved half of it. So I think what they're going at here is identification of the problem is half the battle.
Speaker 2:Yes, identifying the problem. Yeah, articulating the problem.
Speaker 3:Articulating the problem, because then you can clearly address what that problem is. Sometimes I think we get in administration and leadership jobs. We have these messes that are given to us, but they're messes because they're not always clear, right? Or it has layers like an onion right.
Speaker 2:You're peeling layers back, yeah. Or you pull people together into a room because, like, you think there's a problem to be solved and you jump right into problem solution Right, and nobody actually knows what it is they're actually solving for, because the group hasn't come together to actually identify the problem itself. And so you're coming at it from one lens and I'm like no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. And then I'm coming at it from another and you're like no, no, no, no, no. And it's not that either is wrong, it's that we don't have common ground on what it is we're even solving for. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I love this one, I definitely agree with.
Speaker 3:And I think we skipped this a lot too.
Speaker 2:I think it's probably human nature to jump right into problem solution rather than problem identification.
Speaker 3:And we've talked about this too we're so quick, I think, in our leadership role, so quick to respond, yeah, and there's times where we need to let our leaders and our and and all those you know what they're when they're dealing with the situation have them come up with some solutions, come to you with the solution you know and and work through it that way yeah, and actually articulate what it is they're solving for.
Speaker 2:So if someone comes into your office with a solution and you weren't sure that there was a problem in the first place, maybe the logical thing to say to that person is okay, well, what problem are you actually solving here? What are you hoping to accomplish with this plan?
Speaker 2:Yeah, a lot of people might not have actually thought of that. They're just. They're so solution oriented, which is a great asset to have as a team member, to be focused on solutions. But if you're solving for the wrong problem, think of all that wasted energy and resources you got it, and that does happen. You know the opposite of this one too. My mind always goes to the opposites. The opposite of this one is to spend too much time on problem identification and not enough time on problem solutions. That's a great point.
Speaker 3:That's a great point.
Speaker 2:I mean, I know that I can. I can do that.
Speaker 3:Because people can pontificate on what the problem is and keep beating up the problem. But but what are the solutions?
Speaker 2:Yeah, because it feels good to it. That's the point of this right Once you've identified the problem, it feels good, yeah, so let's just keep kicking that problem. And then inevitably there's got to be somebody in the group that's like, okay, let's move on.
Speaker 3:What are we going to do about it? We've identified the problem.
Speaker 2:We're all in agreement that it's a problem. Yep, now what Right? Right, all right, go ahead. Number three it's Gilbert's law.
Speaker 3:And I was thinking Gilbert Godfrey, was it Gilbert Godfrey? Yeah, gilbert Great, oh, yeah, that's it. Yeah, so when you take on a task, finding the best ways to achieve the desired result is always your responsibility.
Speaker 2:I'm going to read it again when you take on a task, finding the best ways to achieve the desired result is always your responsibility. I don't know. I don't know about this one.
Speaker 3:Haven't we like talked to like a thousand times about, like, the power of?
Speaker 2:the team Right. I guess, if you own it individually- Finding the best way to achieve the desired result is always your responsibility.
Speaker 3:Okay, hold on. How about if it's a team?
Speaker 2:though, but hold on, let's reframe it right. It doesn't say determining the best way to achieve is your responsibility. It says finding the best way, yes. So this doesn't mean that it has to be you who comes up with the best way. It means that it has to be you who makes sure that the group, or whatever, comes up with the best way Got it.
Speaker 3:So I'll buy that, okay, okay, it's the mechanism, not the solution.
Speaker 2:No, well, yeah, that, and you're responsible for making sure that the best way is identified, okay, okay. It doesn't mean that you're responsible for determining what the best way is Right. You're just responsible for making sure the best way is identified, and that might mean pulling a group together. It might mean doing research. It might mean hiring someone to solve the problem for you. It might mean you know so when you take on a task, finding the best way to achieve the desired result is always your responsibility. I also think that might mean that you cannot delegate response like if you're ultimately accountable, you're accountable. You're accountable like you. You can't sidestep the ultimate accountability. It's your job, you own it. And if you've delegated it to somebody else and it fails, you still own it. All right, I'll buy this one.
Speaker 3:Okay, number four, wilson law If you prioritize knowledge and intelligence, money will continue to come.
Speaker 2:I don't know. If you prioritize knowledge and intelligence, money will continue to come. Wilson's laws If you. I would love comments in the. I would love people to comment on what you think about this one. If you prioritize knowledge and intelligence, money will continue to come. I feel like that's like I don't know. I feel like that's like a social media thing, right, like follow your passion or whatever I don't know. Sometimes you got to take a job and make some money, right, you got to pay the bills. You got to pay the bills. You got to put gas in your car right yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's right, and I think there are plenty of people who are not knowledgeable and who make unintelligent decisions who make plenty of money, like. The opposite of this is also true, right. Yeah, there are plenty of people who are knowledgeable and intelligent that don't have enough money. Right, don't have enough money, right. And there are plenty of people who are not knowledgeable and not intelligent who have plenty of money yeah, yeah so I don't know about this one.
Speaker 3:I'm not sure that this law is true, this is entitled the five most important laws in the world what are they thinking?
Speaker 2:but I think, it's great, though it's good, I would love for other people to chime in like do you think that's true? If, if you prioritize knowledge and intelligence, money will continue to come? Yeah, dude, I, I would love to be a punk rock bass player, right, yeah, and I'm not saying that's not knowledgeable or intelligent, but like I wasn't sure that I have enough money to pay my bills to feed my family.
Speaker 2:Right so yeah, I don't know why is money tied with knowledge and intelligence? On this one, I don't think they're related. Right Right, the Wilson Law. I want to talk to Wilson. What do you think?
Speaker 1:Do you buy this?
Speaker 2:No, all right.
Speaker 3:So this is a resounding success this episode. This is a great episode. All right, the last one.
Speaker 2:All right, falkland law, like the Falkland Islands, go ahead.
Speaker 3:If you don't have to make a decision about something, then don't decide.
Speaker 2:All right. If you don't have to make a decision about something, then don't decide, all right. So if you don't have to make a decision, then don't make a decision about something, then don't decide, all right. So if you don't have to make a decision, then don't make a decision. All right, I'm going to play devil's advocate on this one, cause you know, you already told me I'm old in this episode, so I'm going to continue to be the old crotchety guy, all right. I once read an article I'm sure you're shocked that. I once read an article that said yeah, the worst thing you can say to your team when they come to you with a request is maybe, ooh, yes.
Speaker 3:Or I don't know. You're right, you're right.
Speaker 2:I'm not sure I agree with it.
Speaker 3:But I think probably one of the best answers is I need to think about this and get back to you. We need to sleep on this.
Speaker 2:Yeah, their premise of that particular article not the Falkland Law or whatever that is, but the premise of that article was Greg comes to Mark and says hey, mark, can I go to this conference, can I buy this piece of software, can I take tomorrow off, or whatever If Mark says maybe Greg leaves the interaction, not knowing what to do, yeah, and now Greg doesn't know, does he go back to Mark a day later, a week later, a month later? And if it's something with a deadline, you have ambiguity.
Speaker 3:That's correct. I was thinking that Ambiguous.
Speaker 2:It's ambiguous. And so you are now in a really bad situation as the employee, especially if it's something that's time sensitive or critical. On the other hand, if Mark says yes to any of those things, then you know what to do. You're going to do it. Next issue If Mark says no, then you move on. However, mark, as the boss, reserves the right to always change his mind to yes. I can always say hey, look, I was thinking about it, I've changed my mind. The answer is now yes. So yes and no. You left with a definitive answer.
Speaker 3:Correct.
Speaker 2:Maybe you're left with ambiguity If I give you no instead of maybe. You have a definitive answer and I still reserve the right to change my mind, change it to yes later.
Speaker 2:A little more complicated if I said yes and then changed my mind 24 hours to no, but nonetheless, I think their point was that when people come to you and want a decision from you, you're not doing a good, you're doing a disservice to your crew if your answers are always ambiguous, or if your answers are always undefined, so the answer should be no. However, I reserve the right to change my answer to yes, yes or yes or yes, but no, maybe, no, maybe.
Speaker 3:So I just thought that was interesting and that's the opposite of this one. Yeah, and this is saying if you don't make, if you don't have to make a decision about something, then don't decide.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So maybe it's a little different, because this is if you don't have to, yeah right. If you don't have to make it, well then if let's go back to this one if you don't have to make a decision about something, then don't decide, but if you don't have to make a decision, then who's deciding? What was compelling you to decide in the first place? That you need someone to tell you not to right? What were you deciding on? I wish there were examples. I know we do need examples. We should send this, a link to this episode, to whoever put this out and say come on to a future episode.
Speaker 3:Glitch mines Five most important laws in the world.
Speaker 2:Yeah, because I'm not suggesting that whoever put this out wrote these laws. Obviously, these are laws that they compiled, but I would love to know why the person who put this together thought that these five things were the most important things, the five most important laws in the world. Yeah, all right, I beg to differ, my friend hoffman's law.
Speaker 1:Hoffman's law.
Speaker 2:Hoffman's law is that these five laws stink love it, love it all right, dude, guess what we're already at the time what do you say?
Speaker 3:let's wrap this up. So one of my favorite episodes so far, I don't think we've ever laughed this much it looked good at the time when I was pulling that, so, uh, all right, I don't blame you for this. You didn't write, I know but?
Speaker 2:but listen, don't you think there's a lot of value in the things that don't work too? So maybe these laws don't work.
Speaker 3:Maybe this episode didn't work, maybe this episode, maybe it'll create the most I mean most feedback we'll ever have I hope so right yeah, I would love people's feedback not only on these laws, but also on this episode. So, uh all right, that's there, you have it, and we'll be here all night. We'll be here all night, brother. What?
Speaker 2:do you here all night, brother, what do?
Speaker 3:you say we wrap this up. Listeners, thank you for your support of Logam. Lead on with Greg and Mark. Lead on with Greg and Mark. In the meantime, let's make it a great day and innovate the USA.
Speaker 2:Peace and love everybody, Murphy.
Speaker 1:Law Murphy Law.
Speaker 2:Gilbert Law. Gilbert Law Wilson. Murphy Law. Gilbert Law.
Speaker 1:Gilbert Law, wilson Law, falkland Law, wart wart wart.
Speaker 2:We should do an episode on failed episodes Peace, peace Later.
